This is what you’re referring to:
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This is not necessarily true. The governor has basically overridden all local governments by telling them they CANNOT put stricter measures in place (at least with regards to restaurants and bars capacity). All restaurants SHALL be allowed to operate at 100% capacity. If a local government wants to limit capacities, they must apply for a waiver from the state. In NO case can the capacity be limited to less than 50%. Bars are slightly different; they SHALL be open at at least 50%; if a local government wants to restrict them past 50%, then they can with no waiver required. If individual businesses want to set stricter standards, they can. Mask wearing is unaffected by this as there was never a state mask policy enacted. Local governments can do whatever they want with regards to this (but are not allowed to collect fines if someone does not want to comply).
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Honest questions for those opposed to this change:
Are the survival rates he’s using from CDC to justify this truly legit or are they misleading?
If legit, how much higher should they be before it’s right to push for more economic activity and lower unemployment? Should it be vaccine or bust?
Is it not fair for businesses to apply for a waiver to keep some heavier restrictions if there is data from the locale to justify it? Is it wrong to require justification for being more restrictive but ok for less restrictive?
Seems like this doesn’t affect WDW at all but gives them a green light to ease some things when they decide it is right to do so, which probably won’t be for awhile. Am I missing something? Not totally staking out a side here, but trying to get to the heart of why this seems to be so upsetting to many here.
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Those of you that would seriously consider cancelling if WDW loosened its procedures need to give them that feedback. They are definitely getting the opposite feedback from some (“I’m not coming back until you…”) and need to be hearing from you to balance it.
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Since Covid is spread largely through person-to-person contact, consider how many people you will come in contact with in the two different scenarios. Contact being in “shared air space” for at least 15 min. Masks definitely help mitigate that, but length of exposure is also important.
While flying is quicker, I think you’d still have fewer contacts driving, as long as you avoid any hotel stays with central ventilation.
While driving is very likely to be safer, we really don’t have the data to quantify to what degree. It could be slightly safer or quite a bit.
That said, since masks became mandatory, there don’t seem to be outbreaks traced to airline flights from the studies I’ve seen.
I’d definitely consider any underlying health conditions for your party in considering if the added risk of flying outweighs the benefits. In addition, the CDC put out new age-specific fatality data that show the risks increase significantly once you get past age 50.
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This worries me. Even if WDW doesn’t change their policies.
WDW can enact policies that reduce the number of infected guests and CMs in the parks, and that decrease the chance of transmission. No policy is going to keep all ill people out, and virtually no safety measures can eliminate transmission. The higher the levels of the virus in the community, the riskier activities that bring people together in groups (especially indoors) become.
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One can push for more economic activity and lower unemployment while still keeping measures in place to minimize the spread of Covid-19. It’s not a choice between (A) removing all restrictions and having economic activity and (B) restricting everything and killing the economy.
Was FL ready to further ease restrictions? I don’t know enough about their situation to really say. Based on the minimal data I have looked at, my guess is no, but I’m no expert and I haven’t really delved into the data much. I’m wondering if a shifting of control measures would have been a better way to go. As in, introduce a mask mandate, but loosen up a few other things at the same time?
I honestly don’t know about the survival rate accuracy. While the fact that many people die does motivate my desire to minimize infections, I’m more directly concerned about R0 values when it comes to evaluating the easing of restrictions.
In general, I think businesses should be able to do whatever they want as long as they’re not hurting anyone. The reason why there were limits imposed were to maintain public health. This was seen as a necessity for most (if not all) businesses. If you can prove that your business can operate without that limit while maintaining public health, great. If a business wants to voluntarily have fewer tables or require masks or require shirts and shoes, I think that should be up to them. Just like in normal times, if a business wants to serve all organic food, they don’t need to prove that it is necessary/better.
So I guess my short answer is yes it is wrong. You should only place limits on a business’s freedom of operations when you are preventing harm.
(Is it individual businesses that have to apply to maintain restrictions on themselves, or is it local governments that have to apply to maintain restrictions in their area? I’m a bit confused about this point.)
I don’t think it’s right to put that onus on private businesses. Most do not have epidemiologists, virologists, and infectious disease experts on staff. If we assume the best case scenario where the business genuinely wants to act for the public good, how do we expect them to have the right information and tools to make the decisions that balance public health with their bottom line? And when the competing business across the street decides to prioritize the bottom line, how do they not follow suit?
Disney might have the resources to consult with experts and make reasonably good decisions, but that is not the case for many businesses. Disney is also in a unique place in terms of its client base and position relative to competing businesses. Disney guests come from far and wide, and WDW needs to maintain a reputation as a safe place or its bottom line will suffer. Maintaining public health and economic interests align more for Disney than, say, a local bar. Also, people who love WDW aren’t necessarily going to be equally satisfied with another park; they have greater brand loyalty than many other FL businesses. This gives them more leeway to make decisions that would be damaging to the average FL business.
I am concerned because DeSantis is acting like Covid is no longer a problem. Also because I do not think that he is making good decisions based on solid science. If the goal is to maximize economic activity, we are better served by first getting the virus under some semblance of control and then gradually easing restrictions (guided by the best science available at the time) and closely monitoring infection rates to make sure that said easing does not lead to an increase in R0.
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Isn’t it simple: Everyone wear a mask so we can all get back to business. Until that happens the majority will stay inside, away, not spend money to avoid those that won’t wear a mask or wear one correctly.
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I flew to MCO just a few weeks ago on American. Going down was not bad, maybe 40% full. Coming home DW and i flew back on different days. Both flights were 100% full. No empty seats. This was the only time in out almost week long trip that I did not feel safe
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Well said ppehap. We as individuals seem to be so much smarter these days than we are as a society or we are as a government. One can ignore the virus all they want. Problem is the virus will not ignore you. We visited our son for the 1st time in 6 months this past weekend. He teaches 2 in-person classes at Mizzou. Those of you who are teachers on this forum could probably tell everyone else here word-for-word what the conversations were between him and his mother & I without me saying anything more. (Interestingly more and more of his students are starting to voluntarily migrate from the class room to virtual attendance the longer the semester lasts). And … during our drive there and back I walked out of gas stations 3 times to find another one where I felt safer due to the non compliant crowds inside. You are right, I was not about to spend money to be around those who would not wear a mask.
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I posted this on another thread
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Same here. A very small change like 5-10% more capacity wont bother me as much but laxed masks, huge capacity removing social distancing will.
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Wow, our Gov said the exact opposite. He said parishes could be more restrictive but not less.
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Ive never contacted Disney. What way do u think would be best to be heard?
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Any time I’ve called for reservation etc. I make sure to say “Thank you for…” and I express my gratitude for the policies that make me feel safe going into the magic. The response from CMs is immense gratitude. They’ve told me:
- You wouldn’t believe how many ppl yell at me everyday about having to wear a mask
- Can I share this with my teammates… we really need to hear this right now
- Thank you
- They go off telling me about their stories…
It’s wonderful… .everyone needs to hear gratitude and that they are apprecaited
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Actually, positive rates in Florida have been around 5% for weeks now.
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any data from FL isn’t trustworthy
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I was thinking that I would call to check a few things. 1)My cancel by date is Oct. 31 but if they make policy changes after this that effect my trip, will my cancellation policy change? Because laxed protocols would require me to cancel my trip. 2) How much notice should we expect if protocols were to change?
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I think those are really good questions to call and ask, so they know those factors matter to guests. And ask them if they pass your feedback along or if there is a better mechanism.
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I don’t think that any state’s numbers are trustworthy at this point. Everyone is doing it differently. You can find different positivity ratings for the same state on a variety of websites.
Honestly, the state of Florida’s decisions are going to reflect their constituents. Their constituents vote them in, not tourists. If you are concerned about what is happening, don’t go to Florida. Going to Disney World is a luxury, not a necessity. I’m not saying I agree with what the governor has decided to do, but it is what it is. DW can make their own decisions about their property, but I wouldn’t expect the same level of restrictions outside of the bubble.
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