Credit Card Rewards & Points General Thread

[JJT]

Anyone with a Marriott Boundless, watch out for a new cash back offer for airline purchases - pretty nice deal if you plan to make any direct airline purchases this year…

Note: you need to Activate this offer before using it.

If you don’t have marketing communications on and don’t receive the email, I think you might try using the Chase My Bonus page and entering your Boundless card’s last 4 and your info and see if it pops up for you.

Here’s the captures from the email I just received and the terms from after my own activation.

THOUGHT EXPERIMENT
If not planning to make any direct flight purchases (common for those with boatloads of points)…

What would happen if one bought, say, a fully refundable airline tickets >$250 and cancelled later?
I think I know the answer if similar offers in the past are any indicator.
But I also think sometimes it is better either not to find out, or find out too often, anyway.

[JJT]

@JJT

Anyone with a Marriott Boundless, watch out for a new cash back offer for airline purchases - pretty nice deal if you plan to make any direct airline purchases this year…

OK, Now that I posted that Boundless offer I too a minute to refresh my referral link for that card and noticed the sign up bonus has changed again to the 5-night 50K free night certificates offer - PLUS the new $100 airline credit. (Same terms as those listed above for that credit, I believe.)

I’ve updated my referral link in the Liner Google sheet, others may want to do the same.

OPINION:
FIVE 50K FNCs is a very nice offer, the $100 airline credit is gravy.

But this offer is not necessarily a slam dunk:
FNCs expire after 1 year, so if you decide to get this card and bonus it is a very good idea to have a plan to use those certs.

I also suggest surfing the hotels you might use them at and see if there are time periods where 50K is even enough to stay there on the dates you need.

If thinking about the Swolphin, as many of us would, you can use the MaxMyPoint site to quickly see what various dates are going for in points and $$$.

• Swan MaxMyPoint
• Dolphin MaxMyPoint

Other things to Remember:

• You can pour up to 15K Marriott points on top of a FNC, so the maximum points night you could use them at is a 65K point night.
• While FNCs are great when you can use them - note they do not stack with Marriott 5th night free policy. You can only use 5th night free on a purely points booking.

[ryan1]

I have had the Delta Gold Amex card, and then upgraded it last year to the Platinum card. Won’t go into details now, but basically, when they upsold me the Platinum card (at the airport itself), they also misled the benefits. As a result, after a year, I decided to NOT renew. (The Companion Ticket, which is only good AFTER the first year, ends up being mostly worthless because it doesn’t end up saving me much of anything, even if I COULD use it within the 12 month period.)

I downgraded to the Delta Blue Amex card for now, which has no annual fee. (I noticed that the annual fee for the Gold and Platinum cards has jumped considerably in the past year, so little chance I’d go back to the Gold now!)

I’m no longer sure what to do instead. Or just cancel the card and continue to just use my Disney Visa card almost exclusively. (I do have a second card which I use for “automatic billing” such as Netflix, etc., but not a lot goes on it.)

[JJT]

Frequent Miler recently did quick rundown on Delta cards and status again, but there’s so much going on for Delta cards even I tune out in the middle of all that info.

But as someone who probably needs to be a Delta flyer might be good to check that out.

From your past info, I don’t feel like you’re into playing the new Sign Up Bonus game that often, and that’s where the real points earning is at.

In lieu of that, might be good to look at your future plans and focus on a small number of new cards that will provide nice benefits and/or nearly free stays or flights that apply to your plans and just go for whatever you feel works into your spending easily.

For Disney trips if you can stay at Swolphin and go during lower points times, that Boundless card offer is nice if you can play it right. (Although Marriott still makes you pay resort fees on points/FNC stays.)

Or, in the same line of thought: you could watch for a good bonus on a regular Amex Gold, Biz Gold, etc or Chase Ultimate Rewards card and after earning the Amex or Chase points watch for any good transfer bonuses to Marriott. I used a couple of 70% Chase transfer bonuses to really boost up my Marriott points totals.

To get a feel for how often transfer bonuses happen, you can use Frequent Miler’s search table in this post to see past ones.

Barring all that: If you just want to keep it super simple and just earn the Disney rewards: If you’ve had your Disney Visa more than 24 months, you can cancel, wait a week then reapply and get a bonus.

Usually the best play is 2 player mode:
If you hold the card, refer to your wife for a new one. You get a referral credit, she gets the bonus. If you’re up for holding 2 cards, you could then close your card and use your wife’s referral to open a new one and double it all up. I did exactly that for years before I started playing the larger points game, which has better return.

When getting a new Disney Visa, the math works out that it is best to get the Premier card in year 1 because the higher bonus and higher points earning together outweighs the annual fee. Then, when your annual fee hits again in year 2 you can call or message Chase to downgrade to the no annual fee card.

[ryan1]

@JJT

I don’t feel like you’re into playing the new Sign Up Bonus game that often

We had a signup bonus for the Amex Gold a few years ago, and then they made the offer to upgrade to the Platinum, we got a nice miles bonus (which we have used). But now, it is too soon to re-apply…and, it seems that with the Skymiles cards, at least, they are aware of spouses doing what you are saying, because since I had added my wife to the card, they wouldn’t let her sign up with her own card where it qualified for the bonus.

The annual fee on the Gold card was in the $150 range when we signed up. The Platinum was around $350. NOW, the Platinum is a $895 annual fee, and the Gold is a $325 card! I really think they are targeting VERY frequent travelers/flyers, which we aren’t. Those fees are insane.

Capital One has a Venture Rewards card for a $95 annual fee, and right now they have a 75,000 miles signup bonus…but, I don’t really know how you use miles for an unbranded card. I presume you have to book through their travel…but does their travel charge more for the same flight as booking direct? I’m not sure.

[ryan1]

Oh, another thing I’ve noticed recently…more and more places of business are tacking on fees to offset the cost of using a credit card. That didn’t used to be allowed, but seems to no longer be the case. Often as much as a 3% fee to use a credit card. This offsets any benefit to using the credit card for their rewards! As this becomes more and more common place, I expect I might end up switching back to paying with debit card instead. But, fortunately (as of right now) it isn’t TOO many places.

[ryan1]

@JJT

When getting a new Disney Visa, the math works out that it is best to get the Premier card in year 1 because the higher bonus and higher points earning together outweighs the annual fee. Then, when your annual fee hits again in year 2

Oh, I meant to say…I determined that we still benefit in having the Premier card even after year one because we get 2% on all grocery purchases instead of 1%, which means we bring in much more in additional rewards than the cost of the annual fee. If they raise the annual fee again, though, I might have to revisit that.

[JJT]

For the record, when I mentioned Amex Gold and Biz Gold I am talking about the non-branded Amex cards and not the Delta Gold etc. So, if you haven’t earned those non-branded card bonuses already you’re likely to still be eligible.

I agree the annual fees are pretty nuts, so you do have to play the coupon book game - the Amex gold has a $7/month dunkin credit, which you may or may not value at all and a $10 dining credit, but is only at limited chains. (We buy $10 gift cards for Cheesecake Factory every month then use several to go to dinner eventually.)

The regular Amex Platinum is really a lot of work now, but being able to use even a few of the larger credits offsets most if not all of the fees.

We got Cap One Ventures last year when they had the elevated bonuses - just like Amex and Chase unbranded cards, you can transfer points to partners or use them in the portal. Transfer is almost always the better play.

On Cap One you can also use points to erase charges that code as Travel - things like Disney tickets at Undercover Tourist or the UK-Attraction Tickets are a couple of sites you could use those at, or of course hotels or flights.

Only “issue” is travel erasing only gets you a value of 1 cent per point, when transferring to hotels or airlines could often get you more value.

I don’t always care about maximizing all the time, so my plan is to use our points for erasing Disney ticket costs the next time we’re at Disney. I have plenty of other points to maximize, so getting a set of free Disney tix for 4 is pretty attractive.

[drvillarejos]

@ryan1

I don’t really know how you use miles for an unbranded card.

I do not know about Capital One but with Chase Ultimate rewards points you can book through their portal or transfer (usually better) to the program of choice (as long as it’s on the list).

@ryan1

paying with debit card instead.

Some places charge the fee regardless as we get charged for debit cards too but generally half the cost. I’ve found that if I ask the fees to be removed before I make the purchase I can get them removed or lowered. Anything under 2% if I’m working on a high cost SUB, I’ll consider.

[drvillarejos]

I wanted to confirm that booking our SW flight with DH’s points triggered the pick your seat upgrade that I get for having the right SW credit card. I just had to go back in and upgrade seats after purchase.

[JJT]

@ryan1

Oh, another thing I’ve noticed recently…more and more places of business are tacking on fees to offset the cost of using a credit card. That didn’t used to be allowed, but seems to no longer be the case. Often as much as a 3% fee to use a credit card.

Yes, it has really becoming more common - and I think is unfair: credit cards have ALWAYS had a fee and that fee was obviously built into the prices we were paying. It is not like everyone decided to lower their prices by 3% and then tell us all they would charge us that fee if we used a credit card - they are just tacking it on to the already built in price. <end rant>

On the points side: it is another reason why going for SUBs on new cards is beneficial: when earning a SUB you are likely earning >10x points or more and far exceeding any CC fees.

I am not a fan of using debit cards anywhere I do not have to - I don’t want any system beyond my bank ATM to have direct access to my funds. I prefer the CC take any fraud hit.

[ryan1]

@drvillarejos

Some places charge the fee regardless as we get charged for debit cards too but generally half the cost.

Yeah. I just had to pay our HOA fees, and they were charging 2.99% to use a credit card. Came to over $16 in extra charges. Even if using a card with 2% back, it would have still be a hit of over $5 extra. But paying directly via bank transfer was a flat $.99 fee, so I went that route. (What I really wanted to do was just send them a check, as I’ve always done in the past, but that is no longer an option, so the fee has basically become mandatory!!!)

@drvillarejos

Chase Ultimate rewards points

I’ll check them out.

@drvillarejos

or transfer

@JJT

transfer points to partners

Of course…Delta is not a “partner”.

[ryan1]

@JJT

I don’t want any system beyond my bank ATM to have direct access to my funds.

I don’t use a debit card on-line or at, say, gas stations. But I will use it at Point of Sale locations. Or I used to until I switched to just using my rewards credit card. (Dave Ramsey wouldn’t be happy about that, but I’m still good about it…the biggest problem is that using a credit card, you are potentially diving into deficit territory unless you already have the full amount of money sitting in your bank account already…which I do.)

[drvillarejos]

@JJT

: credit cards have ALWAYS had a fee and that fee was obviously built into the prices

When inflation and/or interest rates are high the processors charge more. But they do also go down when inflation and/or interest rates lower. Very similar to the way fuel surcharge works with many vendors.
Fortunately we use a prime processor and our fees increase less than 1%.

[JJT]

@ryan1

Oh, I meant to say…I determined that we still benefit in having the Premier card even after year one because we get 2% on all grocery purchases instead of 1%, which means we bring in much more in additional rewards than the cost of the annual fee. If they raise the annual fee again, though, I might have to revisit that.

I’d just say that you have to spend a lot more money than you’d think to pay for that annual fee vs the free card -

The free card = 1% everywhere.
Premier: 5% at Disney+, 2% gas/grocery/dining, 1% all other spend.

If we ignore the D+ completely and assume ALL of your spend on the card is for the 2% categories, you need to spend $4,900 just to break even on the annual fee.

$49 / (2% earning - 1% earning you could have gotten with the free card) = $4,900.

[JJT]

@ryan1

the biggest problem is that using a credit card, you are potentially diving into deficit territory unless you already have the full amount of money sitting in your bank account already…which I do.)

Oh for sure - but I knew neither you nor I are doing that at this point.

[ryan1]

@JJT

ou need to spend $4,900 just to break even on the annual fee.

We actually spent at LEAST $18,000 a year using the Disney Visa Card JUST on food/groceries/household, not including any other purchases we make at the 1% level (Amazon), etc. So we definitely benefit keeping the Premier card. The annual fee is more than $49 now, though, so the benefit is shrinking.

[drvillarejos]

@JJT

I don’t want any system beyond my bank ATM to have direct access to my funds. I

My debit card stays locked. I don’t use it. In Mexico last year I needed to withdraw cash. It kept getting declined. When I called she said the only thing that’s the problem is your card is locked.
I just tried to explain to my sister about SW points and SUBs. She wants us to go to Atlantis in October but flights are very expensive for her family of 4. I explained that if she opened a SW card with 60k points SUB she could pay for her flights. She says her DH likes his double cash and it pays the most. I had to break down the math for the math teacher of teachers. $3k in spending for $149 nets you $1500 in flights. That would cover the Atlantis trip rt flights. This would also give you perks to pick your seats for free at the 48 hour mark (or pay a little extra to pick them at booking, I paid about $75 to upgrade our 2 one way seats to the extra leg room seats we like.)

[jbakken]

Can you explain how the points work? Once I reach the min spend, will they transfer me points right away or does it take awhile? Looking at a trip in Sept. does it have to be under 50k points per night or just the total under 250k points even if less than 5 nights? Looks like some nights around the dates we want are under 50k and some are over 50k. Is this not the same as “booking with points” so can’t get the free night when booking 4?

[JJT]

With this bonus you don’t get points - you get 50K Free Night Certificates.

Best to think of each certificate as a free standing free night and remember that certificates are not points even though they have a maximum point value.

That means:

@JJT

While FNCs are great when you can use them - note they do not stack with Marriott 5th night free policy. You can only use 5th night free on a purely points booking.

On their own you can use each certificate for any night that costs up to 50K, but if you have Marriott points outside of this bonus you can add up to 15K points to each certificate to book rooms that are listed up to 65K per night.

So, for example if you were looking at these couple of weeks in June, you would not be able to use a certificate from the June 25th to July 1st, you could use one on the 2nd and not on the 3rd.

I believe once I hit the spend on my card the certificates appeared right after the credit card month closed - but Chase does say it can take up to 8 weeks for them to appear so YMMV.