I don’t think a park strictly devoted to Star Wars would have worked (even though it’d be the best thing in the world for me, personally). Thinking on it now, I think even this hotel is a bit of a gamble at the moment.
Right now, Star Wars is super hot. It’s always been popular in subculture, but it was never at a point where it was "cool’ to dress up as characters like it is now. But this is still a fad, and fads fade after enough time. Additionally, with the plan of having a movie every year or thereabouts, as well as cartoons and shows coming, it has the potential to over-saturate the market.
And as soon as that happens, that fad is going to end. And while it won’t spell complete doom or anything for Star Wars, it will mean a park and/or hotel where billions have been spent will never see a return on investment.
So if they could get the park built overnight, it’d be a slam dunk, but a park that will take 10+ years to build is a very risky proposition especially considering we might be at the feverpoint of the fad right now. By the time the park opens, Star Wars might be as boring as the Power Rangers to many.
If I’m honest, I think it is my generation and older that has the strongest draw to Star Wars. For us, it is an emotional appeal. Star Wars was, for us, the same as Harry Potter is to the younger generations now. It was a defining piece of culture.
But when I talk to those who aren’t a whole lot younger than me, such as those in their low to mid thirties or younger, Star Wars is worth watching and all, but it doesn’t affect them the same way. I mean, I was literally in TEARS when I was watching the 10 minute film about the (then) upcoming Star Wars VII. To my kids? “Oh, that looks like it might be good.”
So, yeah.
For the MOMENT, they might be targeting Star Wars well for those of us who simultaneously are in stages in life were we have more disposable income, as well as have the emotional pull. But what happens in 10 years?
Yes and no. Because what about the people who are in that area of the park, but didn’t partake in anything? Who was just passing through vs who was there only for a specific thing? When a show ends, what is the dispersal pattern? And for people like me, who aren’t enamored with rides and sit-down shows, I’m now on the radar. What am I willing to stand-by for? All of that can’t be answered by anonymous numbers counting or queue lines or end-of-day totals. MBs also answer where the guest came from. Or what roaming entertainment is popular (like the Dapper Dans). MBs now track that information instead of “eyeballing” it. And then there’s the deep-dive information of getting an instant-census of the demographic buying what merchandise since you’re now identified when you use your MB.
You said it doesn’t help much in historical data but they do. When I was planning my last few trips, I was trying to find a communication system for a group in the park and stumbled onto Magic Band data for Epcot. It mapped out where everyone was going and what not in World Showcase. So all of it is recorded and processed by someone. One of the more interesting things I saw was the World Showcase lake boats (i don’t know the name) was actually not that popular compared to everyone just walking around the rim.
Theoretical capacity, yes. But actual utilized capacity, I’d argue they are getting a lot more.
LMA and the Backlot tour, for example, were often half empty while ToT and RnRC had long lines. If capacity is there but not being utilized, it might as well not be there. Same with Universe of Energy. And Tron is net new. Where I don’t think we are really gaining anything is with Mickey replacing GMR. I’d heard a possible plan had been to refurb and update Great Movie Ride and put MMRR in Animation Courtyard, but that was nixed from a cost perspective.
Plus, with Galaxy’s Edge, I get the impression that there’s a lot to do besides the two attractions - that the interactivity of the land is an attraction in and of itself. So where there really wasn’t much to do on Streets of America, they are adding usable square footage to the park and a lot of other stuff to do.
There *have been a number of “net gains” in the past two and upcoming 3 years. The afore-mentioned GE and Tron, but also 2 whole lands (Pandora and TSL) with 2 rides each - all of which are on previously unused land. EP will see the opening of Ratatouille. Sort-of new will be the “Fun City” (or whatever they are calling it) going into the old WoL building (which was essentially unused except during festivals, and even I never saw it never very crowded).
I’ll be the first to say too little, too late, but this 6 year period that we’re in the middle of is seeing more additions than WDW has had in several decades.
This is true. On the other hand, the attractions being replaced were more “one and done” experiences (not that there weren’t some who would do them again). That is, at MOST someone would do it once per trip. But the new rides, while increasing actual capacity is also “doubling up” on capacity. That is, some of them are attractions people will do over and over again, more than once in a trip or even in a given day. So some of that additional capacity is effectively lost.
I did start out saying that some capacity has been added, but that MOST of the additions are replacements, not therefore no truly additions of capacity.
Our last trip, we did Backlot tour again (since it was about to close down). Despite there being almost no wait on pretty much everything (we were there in October, so low crowds) the Backlot tour was still mostly full. Of course, I’m sure they weren’t running trams as often as they once did!
I think that may have been because it was about to close, everyone went on it. But my main point stands - whether or not we think they’re adding enough capacity or not, what else can Disney do to allow trips to be more spontaneous and less stressful with crowds?
That is the crux of it, for sure. Trips used to be more spontaneous and less stressful, for sure. Of course, I blame the Fast Pass as one of the primary reasons this has changed. I’ve said it ad nauseum here, but I think that the FP almost single-handedly led us to where we are today. I want them gone, I tell you. Eliminate the FP entirely!
Anyhow, there is no chance Disney is going to eliminate them now. But perhaps the rumors to monetize them might help some, if they manage it right.
Adding MORE capacity will help. I think the addition, for example, of the new play area in Epcot will help some, as will adding the Ratatouille ride, since they are absolute increases. But Disney also needs to somehow limit overall crowds. At this point, higher prices is the only way to do this, I fear.
FPs aren’t the problem if you really think about it. It’s the more philosophical case that it’s the cost vs time that is the problem. If Disney wasn’t so costly, we wouldn’t care we’re losing so much time in lines. But as FPs are ways to gain time and maximize your “vacation profit”, it becomes a high priority.
But there’s a secret option: let go. Turn off the targeting computer and relax.
Don’t worry about specific rides, meets, or table services. Those things are really the only things that seem to stress anyone out as far as I can tell. Grab what FPs you can just before you go and then go and eat at Quick Service or just grab reservations like you normally would at home (morning/afternoon you go eat).
If it’s “spontaneous trips” then it’s likely not the “only trip we’ll ever go on.” so there’s no need to worry if you don’t get to ride FOP this time, or eat at a specific restaurant. But you got to ride Haunted Mansion and Star Tours. Not too shabby…
I’ve done next to no planning for my trip coming up and I’m not worried. Of course, part of it is that I’ve done Disney enough times to know where the pitfalls and loopholes are. But I never worry about rides and if I can’t get the Table Services I’m after, there’s lots of runner ups that are viable. Honestly, the biggest stress I have is regarding the flight part because of the annoyances of the airports these days.
My question is, why would Disney ever want trips there to be spontaneous? How would that benefit them? I can’t think of any reason. They don’t want thousands of people randomly showing up, they want to know months in advance what days you’ll be there, which park you plan to go to, where you will eat, etc. That way they can staff the parks as efficiently (cheaply) as possible.
Do i like this? Not really, but i can’t fault them for doing it.
That’s great for those who go often. There are many of us who don’t go often, and might never go again. So yes, it does matter if we don’t get to ride FOP. Pandora was just something people said had no place in a Disney park last time I was there. Of course we’ll still have fun if we don’t ride it. But it will be a lasting disappointment.
I think the FP is a necessity to deal with the crowds. FP spreads the load to smaller attractions and to different times of the day.
TP did an analysis when FP was first introduced and found no change in standby wait - some attractions went up a little, some down. Swings were more prominent when there was tiering. But on average, standby waits didnt increase or decrease.
What does happen is the peak times become less. If not for FP we’d probably see waits for BTMR be regularly 180 min instead of 85 min at the peak of the day, for example. So even if they got rid of FP completely, it would just shift the problem, not fix it.
I agree with you about this…but I also agree with @Randall1028. The disappointment comes when we put too much pressure on the trip itself. In the past year of pre-planning for our upcoming 2 trips, I’ve seen how much I found myself putting pressure on myself for thinking I have to get it all done, etc. But, my wife and I have been talking, for example, about our trip to Disney in May 2020. We’re going to HS, but we’ve decided not to expect to do ANYTHING in SWGE except perhaps walk around. There will be two unique, wonderful rides there we’ve never experienced before, and I have already found that just PLANNING on not doing them has made my thinking about the trip so much better. If we HAPPEN to find a time to get to experience either of them, bonus. But there is so much there we love that we’ve already experienced and are going back to experience again, so what if we don’t get to ride MFSR or ROTR?
I’ll still get FPs that I think will save us time as best I can. But I’m not going to stress about it as I was doing a few months back.
While I have no hard data to back this up, I can say from personal experience that when we went to Disney during a peak time period right after Epcot opened, my brothers and I would get in line for BTMR. It was COMPLETELY full (the queue) with extra queue outside the normal queue. This was before FP. We rode it several times that day, plus all the other rides. Without FP, the standby line (or just “the line” was it was back then) moved MUCH MUCH faster. Never experienced 180 minute waits. I’m not even sure we experienced much more than 30 minute waits.
Bit of a paradox on that. If you care about a specific ride, you weren’t able to “let go about riding rides.” Which was the alternative option.
And If it’s a once and done or a once-a-long-time trip, that’s not able to be treated as a spontaneous trip though, is it? I certainly don’t think I’d go somewhere on a whim if I don’t get a chance to visit often and question if I’ll ever return. I’d have to have SOME plan in place.
(and Pandora still has no place in the Disney parks )
Only one answer: random influx of cash. Whether or not they are properly staffed doesn’t matter once you’ve plunked down the money for your ticket.
I definitely don’t expect to do it all. We are quite selective in what we do! I am feeling extra pressure on this trip because my parents are coming though. They had a rubbish trip with my sister and this is their do-over. So maybe I am trying a little too hard.
Crowds were much lower back then. By orders of magnitude. I think MKs annual attendance has doubled since then. FP was needed because of the sharp rise in crowds that occurred in the late 90s and then again in the late 00s and through the 2010s…
Regarding not stressing - this is the best thing I ever decided to do with regards to my Disney trips. I still plan because it’s fun. But I know my plan is just a guide - we frequently alter it, ignore parts, and skip some things. If we don’t get to things, oh well. The important thing is to have fun as a family, and there Disney consistently delivers for us.
That’s what I’m saying. You said let go and don’t worry about rides, restaurants etc. Not everybody can make spontaneous trips and not care what rides they get to do. Some of us wait years or only ever visit once and so of course we care. So while not caring is great for some, it’s not great for all of us.
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