Thank you for the update! I’ve been wondering.
I’m glad the Hampton worked for you. At least you could relax some there after the days you had.
I’m glad you can get tested. I think here, symptoms are required. Please share here what your result is.
I’d be happy to believe this with confirmation.
I don’t think anyone has suggested there be a different policy for every city. For every state, yes. Except for very similar states who have voluntarily grouped up, as some of the states in the northeast have done, in which case it’s very smart to work together.
And, as others on this thread have pointed out, some states have very different policies in different parts of their states, which also makes sense. For example, in my state mask-wearing is not required if there are 4 or fewer active cases in any given county. It’s hard to argue with that.
Point out one state that did either of those things.
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I shared this with my district team last night. The comments ranged from “I hope they changed policy based on more than one study, that can’t be true…” to “I feel like we are playing whack a mole, and we are the moles”.
We had to go remote since we quarantine whole classes and teachers with positive cases. Usually, that quarantines multiple teachers. We were wondering if we were being too conservative, and then this showed up.
I am editing to add: how can school/districts have guidelines of 5% in school positives, apply this rule and stay open?
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My thing is that I don’t really pay attention to how long I’m around someone. If I am around them a long time, that obviously sticks in my memory. But a few minutes here and there, I’m going to have a lot more difficulty with that. There are people in my office I don’t even know that I’m around from time to time. They work in a different department and with most people working from home most of the time, it’s a lot more difficult to learn names. There are people in stores that you may be close to for that long in few minute increments (you know, that one person that seems to be shopping for the same things you are).
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My point was more that even state of the art hospitals make head-shaking errors.
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Several of my thoughts as well as ventilation. Thinking of airplanes. Moles: the Springfield MO hair stylists.
This example is more data to add to the collection depending on how much detail was obtained regarding the basic health of the guys, were they together before arriving at the prison, how long they’d been in their previous location, in short, as much info as possible. I think of a previous CDC study of positive cases in hospital - the restaurant question failed to specify indoor or outdoor.
The big Army post near us received some 50 recruits during the summer - all testing negative. Within a week one reported in sick; all 50 were tested again with 30 now being positive.
I don’t mind guidance at all. I do expect science.
As to 5% school positives, @PrincipalTinker, I don’t know. Schools aren’t islands.
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We couldn’t handle about a 2% rate with our quarantine rules.
I saw this early yesterday! I did not feel like the article clearly indicated if close contact would be considered if both parties were wearing masks for that 15 minutes or not. I know at our school we consider both parties wearing masks to be NOT a close contact. We also keep kids in cohorts and spread out whenever they take their masks off for lunch, etc. on the flip side, I personally know someone who caught COVID when the friend took a Relative to the hospital. Both were masked during a car ride to the hospital although the relative was very sick and asymptomatic.
Also while reflecting on this today, on separate occasions, I found myself in the face of a small child with a nosebleed. It dawned on me that I may want to wear something more than a cloth mask when I’m on campus where I may end up acting as school nurse at any time. It seems like a good idea but it also seems like overkill.
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Mask usage isn’t considered when deciding who is a close contact. Neither, unfortunately, is being outside.
I got the following from an opinion article discussing the possibility that masks don’t work:
https://gript.ie/wp-content/uploads/2020/10/106747701-1602851791440-20201016_us_vs_eu_cases.png
The author’s point is that mask use in Europe is more prevalent than in the US, but it doesn’t appear to have done them any good. I don’t know if that is a valid point, since there are many reasons why cases could be spiking in Europe. But if masks don’t work it’s probably because they’re not being worn in situations where the virus is being transmitted, not that There is something wrong with the masks per se.
We are told that it is spread through close personal contacts, generally family and friends. But people don’t wear their mask around family- and maybe not around close friends, either. Dr. Fauci was not being silly when he said we should cancel Thanksgiving. Nor was Dr. Birx when she said we should wear masks around our family.
It’s just that very few people are going to do those things.
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This is an on-going discussion right now. We host Thanksgiving, sometimes with more than 20 people. This year, though, we are extremely hesitant at the idea, particular with cases in Michigan rising to their highest point since this started. If human emotions were not involved, we would just say Thanksgiving is off this year and only do it with a very small group (who we interact with regularly anyhow). But there is a mixture of circumstances that make cancelling awkward. So now we’re trying to figure out how to host Thanksgiving responsibly. It is still up in the air, and we still might end up cancelling it.
Of course, we’re mostly worried about our family…particularly our parents, who would be most vulnerable. But I won’t lie. There is the selfish part of me who also worries that if we contract COVID during thanksgiving, our 25th anniversary trip to Disney is doomed!
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Yes, our cases have gone way up, too. But there may be cause for optimism. Others have observed that the epidemic tends to run about a 75 day course. It looks like our peak is now, or just passed.
DD26 is not coming home from NY because she’ll be quarantined when she goes back. But DS28 is coming up from ABQ. Personally, I plan to delay my next round of IV immunosuppressants until after Thanksgiving. Although that puts me at risk for Christmas. I guess I’m hoping it will die down by then.
Everybody has to make their choices. My choice is to see my family, because they’re far away. I don’t think it’s selfish to want to go to Disney World, Especially if you can see your family some other time.
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I suspect Missouri has had several spikes concurrently - we’ve been climbing since July. I read this week from a reliable source that State reporting is 8000 cases behind, based on county health departments.
How are Billings schools doing?
@PrincipalTinker, it seems schools must follow the community. I agree that 2% couldn’t be sustainable. I’m always puzzled at the schools @missoverexcited is near - community seems to be having considerable more spread than the schools, where masks are not being worn.
Suppose masks are effective at reducing spread if the wearer is postive but counter productive if the wearer is not.
@pod, we have the two towns here with similar % population congestion, one with mask ordinance and one without. Similar spread. Hospitals not over run in either community. What we’ve developed is if a mask is requested we wear it, otherwise, not.
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With regards to the new CDC guidelines, I don’t understand how it can make guidelines based on one case study with just six people.
Family units wearing masks at home? DH goes to the office everyday. We don’t wear masks at home. I thought about it but decided against it. His office is at reduced capacity. Everyone wears an N-95 in the office provided by the company. 6 months later, nobody in his office has tested positivity. I MAY rethink wearing masks at home if someone in his office tests positive.
I was wondering what you all were thinking for Thanksgiving. 
We usually have dinner indoors with about 15 people. This year, we are thinking about having Thanksgiving lunch outdoors, and seated with your family unit. Lunch time will be warmer than dinner so we can have it outdoors. If it is too cold to have lunch outdoors that day, we might cancel. DSIL is thinking about streamlining the menu and having one person serve all the food. There will just be one starch, protein (usually turkey and something else), and dessert. And no appetizers.
DD will fly home for Thanksgiving from San Diego. She works in the lab everyday. She will be her own unit for Thanksgiving lunch. When we have visited her or she has flown home, we don’t wear masks together indoors. She is not that different than DH. We eat together. But nobody eats across from her.
We are not set in stone for Thanksgiving except that DD will come home.
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I have gone to work every day since April. I don’t wear a mask at home but my mom has been in the hospital since last week and I don’t feel it is safe for her or anyone else for me to go there. I have only seen her outside, from a distance since this began.
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Welp, our school is definitely defining both parties masking as not being a close contact.
Cases here are creeping back up, but we have only had one positive case on one of our campuses (abt 700 adults and children) - a never symptomatic teacher. Sometimes I think we are doing so much to prevent an outbreak but other times I wonder if it is all theater. Also, I feel like our preventions are only as good as the weakest link.
I haven’t decided what to do with this, either. My parents are hosting and we will be fresh off a road trip to Big Bend. Here in Texas it could be 85 or 55 for Thanksgiving or Christmas. We could probably set up outside but weather could muck it up.
I haven’t dived into Xmas yet as it’s our year to join DHs family and I feel fairly certain they won’t attempt outdoors. If DH can settle in a new job by (He should. He’s in the middle of interviewing for several positions) then I may see about finding somewhere to go out of town for just our family.
I also saw recommended to get a Covid test, isolate for 5 days after testing if it’s negative and then joining with family for a holiday celebration. It’s not a perfect solution, but adds a buffer. I may offer to host at my house and include only those who can do that ahead of time. Oh! Or we test twice in the week leading up to Xmas and travel to visit my aunt and uncle again.
But all this testing depends heavily on testing being readily available with quickly delivered results. That is currently the case here, but who knows at Xmas.
@ryan1 I’m also jealous of your Disney trip. Ours would have started Dec. 8. Now adjusting anniversary plans for Texas hill country on our actual anniversary. Fingers crossed.
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Protect the vulnerable. Implement reasonable measures to get the rest of us back to living.
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Our thanksgiving is normally I work 7-3:30 and come home to company from Canada (my mom’s family) who arrived to my mom’s house the night before. They usually show up after lunch and hang with DH and kids.
They are not allowed to cross the border this year 
so I’m afraid our thanksgiving is going to look like any other day’s dinner. I’m just so tired of being constantly exhausted by the losses.
Maybe we can find someone else to join us. Some friends who also won’t be with family.
I’m. So. Over. This.
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Sorry your mum is in hospital. Visitors are still not allowed here, it’s very hard but I think you are doing the right thing.
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